* A litle note to further explain the nature of this conflict:
CONSIDER: Who would be against quantified information about marijuana seedbanks ?
1. Law Enforcement
2. Anti-Marijuana contingents
3. Ripoff Seedbanks who face exposure and loss of funds.
It all started a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away... well really, in the newsgroup alt.drugs.pot.cultivation.
(At the time of writing, there is said to be yet another new "newsgroup"
as well, alt.cannabis.seedbanks )
(Sunny)=Yes, the Spammers feel the need to actually controll a newsgroup
We used to read alt.drugs.pot.cultivation for marijuana seeds reports
but have now mostly given up. There's too much "Spam".
(Sunny)= SPEAK FOR YOURSELF, TROLL
Not the normal kind of spam, but a different kind.
(Sunny)= Like the kind I am responding to here.
Normally newsgroup "Spam" is advertising messages from companies trying to get you to buy products from them.
In alt.drugs.pot.cultivation it goes a different way - anonymous people
claiming to be independent and trying to persuade you to get your seeds
from some companies instead of others.
(Sunny)= Actually trying to keep people from getting ripped off. These people are the same ones who daily respond to other's questions about how to grow weed.
Little messages like "That seedbank ripped my mate off".... "marijuana
seeds delivered in 2 hours from this seedbank!" "XXXseedbank is LEGITIMATE"....
"Don't buy from this seedbank, buy from this one here instead"... etc.,
etc., etc. for ever more, till the world ends, that newsgroup and any others
like it, are probably going to be spammed.
(Sunny)= No 'Regulars' engage in these types of comments.
Will it ever end?
(Sunny)= It will if this TROLL will go away.
Probably not. It seems to be getting worse, but recently, more crafty....
with the spammers putting "real-looking" names, into their (totally anonymous
and untraceable) messages, and building their spam into message-threads
with subject titles not directly related to their "promotional" writings.
(Sunny)= It got worse after a couple of supposed 'seedbanks' got downgraded for bad business practices. Beeoo's was not listed because of the legal questions surrounding his 'American Seedbank'.
(*** At this date, April, 22, 1999 Beeoo's is history and was found out to be a non-delivering seedbank***)
This gives the overall impression that the newsgroup has genuine content,
however, as soon as you start trying to read the messages.... you may begin
to get the impression that all is not what it seems, and that many people
putting up the anonymous messages are really just dodgy seed-traders in
disguise. It is our impression from that newsgroup, that the majority of
the seedbank-related posts are immensely devious and pathetic "spams" designed
to create market confidence in the companies of spammers.
(Sunny)= There may be many false seedbank reports sent in. Ther are usually no problems getting product from seedbanks with favorable ratings from 'greenman'
About a year ago there was somebody (anonymous) called "Ganjaman's"
which was supposed to be "rating" different seedbanks.
(Sunny)= This is True.
They setup a web-site which was heavily "Promoted" in the newsgroup alt.drugs.pot.cultivation and also on Bulletin Boards all over the internet. The bulletin boards were plastered with messages encouraging people to go for "Ganjaman's seed ratings" pages. Some called this "spamming" too, but it was impossible to tell, because the messages were anonymous.
The "ganjaman" web page had a list of seedbank companies, with little pictures of seeds after each one.
The seedbanks that were supposed to be "better" or "good" got more little
pictures of seeds after their names, than the ones that were supposed to
be "worse" or "bad".
Well now right at the top of this list appeared a site called "Jock's" seedbank.
This seedbank was given the top marks and even had a message saying to readers:
"All seeds excellently priced, highly recommended... Same day service. Tell him "Ganja Man sent me"."
Many hailed Ganjaman as a kind-hearted person who was doing the world a favour by giving his advice and thought that this really was a great place to buy your seeds.
Soon it seemed that some people were taking Ganjamans word as Gospel.
Many people believed the Ganjamans ratings to mean that Jocks was the best
seedbank in the world and sent money to Jocks for seeds. Some say they
received their seeds. Other people say they didn't receive their seeds.
(Sunny)= I believe Jock always sent the seeds based on reports to ADPC. Do you have PROOF of anything to the contrary?
Sooner or later people got round to thinking that perhaps everything
wasn't as simple as it looked.
Questions were asked as to
After a while, questions were coming up here and there asking why some
seedbanks were rated as "bad" when people said they had received good seeds
from them, and why some seedbanks were rated as "good" when people said
they were not getting their seeds at all.
(Sunny)= That post was one of the first spams from whoever is trying to run down the ratings system and it occurred long after the Gangaman person was gone
Various theories were considered on this issue:
1) Was the site run by law-enforcement?
2) Was the site a public-relations scam, intended to "soak up" complaints regarding seed sellers?
3) Another question began to circulate:
(Sunny)=In this TROLL's mind
The truth may finally have been exposed, with a large "Bang" for anybody who may genuinely have stated they had ordered from Jock's and gotten nothing, when.....
After some time, messages appeared on Usenet (alt.drugs.pot.cultivation)
in "ganjaman's" name saying that there was a business deal going on, and
that Ganjaman was getting commission (paid in seeds) from Jocks when people
sent money to Jocks after seeing his name on Ganjaman's "seed listing"
site. (They could not really miss Jock's, it was, after all, at the top
of the list, with the most little seed pictures after it, and a special
report from Ganjaman that Jock's was "highly recommended", and to "Tell
him "Ganja Man sent me")
(Sunny)=If you'll look at the ratings, you'll see that Jock's, while having a very good delivery rating, does get downgraded for 'speed of delivery'.
Messages subsequently appeared also, on the newsgroup, in the name of
"Jock", which said that this was True!
It is very easy to post anonymous messages to newsgroups which cannot
practically be traced back to you.
(Sunny)=True(Click
here to see how)
It's dead-easy to set yourself up with an anonymous address at somewhere
like nym.alias.net and begin to infiltrate the net community under the
cover of a "genuine guy". This is most true in newsgroups and chats where
discussions of illegal activity may happen to occur.
(Sunny)=ONLY A COP WOULD WANT YOU TO POST IN THE CLEAR
Putting up a web page in your name and making a few news-postings here
and there, soon establishes you with an internet presence, whomever you
may be.
(Sunny)=True
It would be very easy to setup 5, 10, 20 or even 100 anonymous e-mail
accounts, all at once! All in different names, and suddenly you would have
an entire "gang" of invisible promotors! With such a gang of anonymous
personalities, all operating under different names, you can give the impression
of being a "community" of say 20 people, when really, there is only one
of you, controlling all the different "personalities" (each of which is
"really happy and satisfied" with your company" !!! ), and nobody can ever
find out that this would really be a giant public-duping scam.
(Sunny)=That could be done easily at first. But over a period of several months, very few individuals are complex enough to carry it off.
More Questions:
This page is the first, there probably will be more warning of the implications of the claimed "Jock & Ganjaman deal" in one way or another.
For a hypothetical unscrupulous seed trader who wants to spam-up his traffic to his site, or to his site(s), whilst taking the opportunity to put his competitors down a peg or two, one of the best ways of doing it might have been to start spamming the internet with "ratings" of seedbank companies.
No longer. We're on the case.
(Sunny)=Anyone can tell you are only one person; why do you keep saying WE?
Is it the multiple personalities you have that you are refering or what?
Don't believe anything anybody says to you on the internet unless it
makes sense to you.
(Sunny)=I wholeheartedly agree.
A concerned hemper or a couple of thousand students.
(Sunny)=I'm an ole hippy and know a little about this last spam. If it were a couple of thousand students, Don't you think there would have been a much bigger stink? Heck, with not a lot more than that, we made headlines on every national publication and every television channel when we decided the war in V.N. was a bunch of crap.
References:
Here is a link to the first "Ganjaman" site. This seems nowadays to be abandoned. Some say the ratings seem to have "balanced" themselves out a bit, making them look less biased since:
A) The "seed-bunging affair"
B) The new "Greenman" appeared to have taken over from it, and started "rating" seed banks on anonymous e-mail "reports" instead of "Ganjaman"......
http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Underground/3291/
(If the above link goes down, try this one, it's a URL-forwarder for the site: http://www.ganjaseeds.home.ml.org )
We were going to post a link to the dejanews article in which the anonymous
webmaster, "ganjaman@nym.alias.net" AKA "spacemanspliff The new Greenman page
Click here to see the new "listings" in operation!
http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Vines/9863/seedbank.htm
You may notice that the new "Greenman's" ratings are a lot more varied
than the old "Ganjaman" site now appears. Here's another:
"Sunny's Seedbank Ratings" is/was an identical web-mirror version of
the above that has just been kicked-off the Geocities web-server at the
following URL:
http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/Delta/7899/seeds.html
It has today (21st July 1998) relocated to this URL:
http://members.tripod.com/~bbop/seedbanks.html If you take a look at the newsgroups, you'll also see the new "Greenman's
ratings" are the ones now being "promoted" down there, amongst the hundreds
of totally anonymous messages, in place of the long-abandoned "Ganjaman's
ratings"
(Sunny)=Oh, How convenient; all this spew with no evidence. What a jerk!
or never archived there at all, perhaps due to the usage of "X-No-Archive=Yes"
headers which prevent archiving, meaning messages can be here today, gone
tomorrow forever. If you want the full text, why not go down to the newsgroup
and ask. At least a few people may have it archived somewhere. Who knows,
"Ganjaman" might do a comeback & re-admit the "situation" just for
you.
(Sunny)=What would you expect from a different person. Actually, thase pages are administered by a person called NPK, I think.
(Sunny)=HOORAY, He finally got around to mentioning my site. He also kinda let the air out of his ballon. Do you think a cop would "get kicked-off the Geocities web-server?
Well, do you?
(Sunny)=Was also kicked off the tripod site :-(
(Sunny)=There is nothing new about the ratings; They've been posted to ADPC since Janruary and many thousands of heads have used them to point themselves to a reliable seedbank.
Disclaimer: The above represents the views of an anonymous
group of hempers, and may or may not represent the views of anybody else.
We merely comment and pose legitimate concerned questions on various messages
which have been observed by the authors in and around "A.D.P.C" [alt.drugs.pot.cultivation]
which is a newsgroup. This newsgroup has recently been supplemented by
another: "A.C.S" [alt.cannabis.seedbanks]. Because these newsgroup messages
above referred to, are themselves anonymously posted, it is impossible
to say with any degree of certainty, which message came from which person.
(Sunny)=Thank GOD this person FINALLY admits he REALLY doesn't know about any of this for sure.
Simply because a message appears to have been posted by a particular author,
does not establish the identity of the sender. Therefore it is impossible
for many, if any, of the questions above to ever be resolved for certain,
due to the fact that all the characters referred to, can be identified
only as anonymous e-mail addresses, out there somewhere.
(Sunny)=Please read this last line of his again.
This page is intended
for information only, and only for those such as British and Dutch people
who can legally buy/sell marijuana seeds under the laws of their countries,
it is not intended to encourage anybody to do anything illegal. Marijuana
cultivation remains illegal in many countries. This page may regularly
be updated.
(Sunny)=If this is true, why do you spam for Beeoo's Spambank which purportedly will only sell to Americans??? Authors the2000students@hotmail.com
are NOT interested in receiving "seedbank reports".
High there everyone who could wade through all that crap. I really hated to waste my time with exposing this Beeoo Spammer but I couldn't let it ride. I can promise you one thing though; Come on over to ADPC and lurk and read for a few months before you make up your mind. I don't think you'll have much respect for this kind of Spambank crap after you've had a chance to get an idea of who we really are. That said, the clock reads 4:18 and i've got a little something to do@;~)
Sunny